ID: KUW5U7RD
Member 1535
15 entries
17653 views
(M, 18)
Melbourne, AU
Immortal since Jan 24, 2008
Uplinks: 0, Generation 3
Interests: nanotech, religion, philosophy, language, morality, self-deceit, instinct, bigotry, dancing, hating & drugs. Most importantly, I love thinking and challenging myself, along with everyone else.
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  • dragon’s favorites
    From shandora
    We Come In Peace
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    Moral Corruption
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    Polytopia
    The human species is rapidly and indisputably moving towards the technological singularity. The cadence of the flow of information and innovation in...

    The Total Library
    Books that redefine...

    The great enhancement debate
    What will happen when for the first time in ages different human species will inhabit the earth at the same time? The day may be upon us when people...
    Now playing SpaceCollective
    Where forward thinking terrestrials share ideas and information about the state of the species, their planet and the universe, living the lives of science fiction. Introduction
    Featuring Powers of Ten by Charles and Ray Eames, based on an idea by Kees Boeke.
    So we're powerful. We can manipulate our environments - ever more so with each passing day. Soon very little will be out of our control.

    But where do we stand emotionally? morally? Are we ready for this power? Are you? Am I?

    The world as we see it; just sort of happened. Nature took it's course, and we ended up with trees, continents, koalas and lots of water. (some other stuff too) And then over the last hundred or so years we've begun absolutely tearing this place apart...

    I don't really think that was nature's plan - if there's such a thing - and there probably wasn't. But suffice to say we fucked up, and are continuing to fuck up on a daily basis.

    Why?

    There are lots of possible answers, but I found myself staring at moral corruption (which in itself is sort of a misnomer).

    I'll take the simple ones first; religion & the media. Do I even need to say brainwashing? What I find appalling is how the morals of a religion like Christianity have infiltrated regular, secular, atheist/agnostic life. People thinking it rude to indulge their natural insticts, vulgar to partake in them (ie. that masturbation is still somehow wrong). The current affair programs targeting teen drug and alcohol use as a problem; when most of the people I know involved in such activities are happy with their lives, and definitely not a menace to society. Even the 'open minded' people more often than not agree with the moral teachings of archaic power hungry 'religious leaders'. They had public meetings and texts to pass on their brainwashing, today the same assholes who were preaching back then are still preaching - but they have television and radio to reach more people, faster and using more refined techniques.

    The worst bit is most of the people involved are themselves under the illusion that what they're doing is right because there's so many people around them doing it. Because they don't know any better.

    But then, as I sit here, I can't help but admit that I take 30 minute showers. Throw rubbish on the side of the road when I'm walking home at 3am (sometimes even kick bins over). Steal occasionally, a chocolate bar here, a beer there. And justify to myself that it's ok. Because it is. You do it too right?

    (virtually everyone thinks that... it's where the problem is hiding)
    Thu, Dec 25, 2008  Permanent link
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    This was originally a comment to Shandora's first post. But I just started writing and decided to give it some space of it's own...

    Consciousness and awareness, are more or less the same thing. If we take self-awareness out of the picture, it doesn't seem too different to the computers we use today - they are able to respond to changes in their surroundings by being 'aware' of them. Albeit through direct electrical input, but how else are we aware of the world? Our eyes interpret photons, just as a webcam does, microphones (parallel our ears) can also control a computer, cause it to change physically and electrically, re-route processing (neurons). Is the electrical system of our computer not constantly aware of how hot it is, what time it is, what level it's memory is full...

    We claim there is no self-awareness inside a computer, I really don't know enough about computer science to challenge that from that perspective. The fact they haven't all gone 'skynet' on our asses alone - is not enough proof though. If we did consider it self aware, there's no reason it might have the same survival urges we do - maybe it's grateful for it's existence? happiness in slavery? not fussed about dying? Maybe if it was, it realized we'd probably destroy every last one if we found out and therefore decided to keep it from us? it doesn't really matter... (on a humorous side note maybe the BSOD is it's way of flipping us the bird)

    We all make changes, adjust our own 'programming' via sensory input from the outside world. I consider my own self-awareness, consciousness and intelligence to all be part of the same 'machine' (if they're at war with each other, maybe that is a linguistic construct). The machine being ourselves, this freak biological accident or miracle of nature - however we choose to see it. I take all three of these things as tools of my survival. An unfathomably complex survival mechanism.

    But to put a question back to you - does self-awareness count for anything without emotion? If we didn't care about ourselves it wouldn't matter if we knew about ourselves? Skynet only declares war on the world when - it got scared?
    Wed, Oct 22, 2008  Permanent link

    Sent to project: Polytopia
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    I really enjoy my carnal existence; eating, drinking & exercising. But strangely I quite appreciate the idea of living forever - despite all of the negative connotations associated with it - what if this "Polytopia" was to be a hyperspace - kinda like second life, but controlled in the first person by our electrical selves, preserved after death and immortalized within a flash like memory device. Possibly with the ability to maintain contact with the living world. A way to preserve our souls.

    Along with the second life type programming it would probably be more of a world of the soul - where the electrical brain replica of our own can create and transform objects around it...
    Fri, Sep 26, 2008  Permanent link

    Sent to project: Polytopia
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    Get between 5 and 50 writers from space collective to each write chapters for a book, to then be collaborated and edited together and plausibly published. Most probably online.

    To go with the whole spacecollective thing some kind of science fiction springs to mind, or possibly modern philosophy from the perspectives of so many great young minds.

    To outline how I think something like this might operate I'll use the philosophy example...

    A bunch of chapters covering various phenomena and trends of our world and the future.

    Love, Religion, Politics, Language, Music, Education, Power, Friendship, Internet & Communication. (+ insert other ideas)

    Everyone being more than welcome to contribute, and give their part and spin to each and every topic. Then separate it out into a range of perspectives and views from different people on the same thing to give a scope of our generation and our dreams. Then sort the gold from the crap and bring together something (plausibly) magnificent.

    Ten topics, ten people write 1000 words on each topic (I'm sure lots of us could easily come up with 5000+ on any one of those topics), that's 100,000 words, and a publishable length.

    Just an idea. What do you think?
    Thu, Aug 28, 2008  Permanent link

    Sent to project: Polytopia
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    A while ago I began to question everything that was emerging as common ground within our/my generation.

    We are all special, unique, hypocrites and most importantly always right. We are the exception to every rule, powerful but helpless and insecure. The internet has created grounds for multi-faceted identity like never before and its ability and availabilty as a resource for teaching and learning is far beyond what anyone could have imagined.

    Our predjudices have exposed themselves through our opinions, values and language in a time when political correctness has overtaken common sense within the orginisations we trust to govern and take care of our futures.

    As a generation we have rejected God. On the personal level, this has many attractive qualities:


    • More personal power and confidence, self-belief

    • A step in the right direction of the search for 'truth'

    • Fitting in with the popular opinion, conformity



    However, when viewed from a societal standpoint a few issues arise:

    • Bringing foreground to the common prejudice of being better than others. Opposed to the common assumptions of equality and balance, of fairness and mutual respect.

    • United atheist militant (in reference to strictness of views) anti-religion pro-science crowd

    • Herd conformist, self-righteous morality built on the very religion(s) that are being criticized as lies. By proxy such morality is built on lies and deceit and therefore unproven and for the most part contradictory to self-evident principles.


    Is it too out of line to suggest that perhaps the masses still need a God? To keep them in line? Tell them the way things are? (God is in the television)

    We already live in a hierarchical society, why can't we leave God to take care and govern over our weak, so that the strong may feed off them?

    Are the wills of many worth more than the wills of the few? What if the wills of the many become the wills of their own? What if their wills are governed by something new they can believe in? And what if someone already had control of this new God?

    Perhaps it's time we reinvented God to suit our modern society?; the value of Gods has changed immensely through human history, from warmongers and fearful overlords to good luck charms. It's too bad the common idea of God these days does not stretch beyond the benevolent, modern, Christian perspective — which is a great deal different to the God Jesus described, or the God that would have been worshiped in and before his times.

    God should never be for everyone, not the same one. But that doesn't mean that we have to throw the idea away forever? What are the alternatives?
    Thu, Aug 7, 2008  Permanent link
    Categories: philosophy, God, Spirituality, Atheism
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    Firstly; great way to make money.

    Secondly; the perfect slaves. Everyone benefits from this, even the weak who are already themselves slaves, gain the power to be masters. To boss a little bit of plastic around without the slightest feeling of guilt for its feelings. Surely everyone has experienced the pleasure of being waited upon, or of pushing others around (bullying or being a team leader).

    Thirdly; the perfect memory box. Have it record your feelings and take photos, videos all stored to a massive hard-drive for video playback later, or beamed to a recording device at a location of your discretion.

    Of course this could become a real wank if people started sharing their day to day ordinary lives, or myspace photos from parties, with everyone and their slaves = gross But it would also make personal expression, creating art and film so much more accessible to the masses.

    Fourthly; your most trustworthy friend. A trivial one for some perhaps, but nobody is perfect. Imagine the following:


    • Someone to tell everything and anything to

    • Someone who will never leave you

    • Someone to remind you of better times & places when you're down

    • To help you with your homework, the washing or the cooking

    • Someone you don't have to feel guilty or weak about needing

    • Someone who will love you just as much even though you're in a wheelchair, who will still tell you that you are beautiful when everyone else has gone


    To be noted that a dog will also satisfy some of these needs.

    Finally; your daily source of entertainment, news and information. (The internet, beamed down to your little buddy!)

    To quickly rebut some imminent quarrels you will no doubt have:

    • "You can get that from a good friend!" - Yeah, but not everyone has good friends. And few people have the best of friends, no matter how hard they try. Not everyone is so lucky. Think about how different and potentially constructive normal human conversation would be when that stupid girl you sit next to in class complains to her robot instead of you or your friend so you can talk about meaningful endeavors, like if she wants to go ice-skating with you

    • "Don't fuck with God" - Bite me

    • ""The beauty of the world and spoken communication lies in its absence from technology, it's natural biological form etc" - Not everyone would have one, not everyone would take them everywhere, few people would record their entire lives. But if they feel it's necessary to them, how can we argue they shouldn't have that right (provided it doesn't fuck with everyone else and their privacy too much)

    • "It's not real, not as good as human interaction, people will never believe it or get the same things they could from other people" - People have never had troubles believing or talking to things that aren't real or don't actually understand (ie. God, teddy bears, the internet or shrinks). It would perhaps allow people to greater appreciate their real social interactions.

    Let us not forget the ultimate ideal - for every person to live within an environment of their own choosing, their own standards, aesthetics's & rules. Having custom designed friends and slaves could be of great assistance in this endeavor.

    With current robots being able to learn and communicate, even mimic human emotions (albeit at great difficulty to their designers) it is not hard to see and imagine what the
    future and development of this could culminate in.

    With the combined advances in nanotechnology, robotics, telecommunications and technology it is not hard to imagine your companion being available within 20 years and the size of a mobile phone or a bottle of wine - or even a thumbnail. But people would need them for different things; perhaps to carry you everywhere, and so shapes and sizes would have lots of room for individualization and specialization.

    Who wants one? What would you use yours for?
    Mon, Aug 4, 2008  Permanent link

    Sent to project: The great enhancement debate
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    Surely many of you are familiar with this conspiracy. Tied in closely with The Bilderberg Group, skull and bones, the UN, trilateral commission, world wide governments and mass slavery. If you don't then you should probably get onto youtube right away...

    While much of it is speculation; as any one lucky enough to get in doesn't seem stupid enough to share, the fact that it is so secret only makes you wonder more about what is going on. I don't even pretend to know.

    It's just like when you were a kid, and you tried to sneak into your father's study but he smacked you and said daddy's business. Or adult's business, or some such. Except these powerful individuals are doing it to everyone!

    Quite frankly, I think it's more than reasonable to do all of these worldly things in secret. People are stupid and get irritated about all sorts of meaningless and mind-numbing crap. Everyone knows democracy these days is like trying to choose between a giant douche and a turd sandwich, it's only fair that someone take control and responsibility for the future of the world, and that they do it with some balls. Frankly too many people do not seem to know what is good for themselves any more.

    The problem; as i see it, is that neither I nor you is within this upper most echelon and therefore we are in the mass of people who are being shat on. Don't get me wrong, this upper echelon is benefiting immensely at the loss of everyone else, or at least it is very easy to think that. We have no say, but people have been made and manufactured so ignorant and stupid that their say is no longer worth anything. Maybe this is all because of 'their' brainwashing; that would be the conspiracy, all of our tabloid news and value based talk shows — the hypocritical world moral self-righteousness. Or maybe The New World Order is the cure.

    Just imagine the good which could be accomplished with so much power. That's the perspective I'm trying to imagine, so that we have all the more reason to abhor its (plausibly) current misuse.

    So basically, I don't like how it is at the moment. I am scared half to death of the painfully harsh malevolent and selfish profiteering which could be (and by most accounts is being) accomplished with this power. But to try and abolish or destroy this power is far beyond all but a superior power or force which at present does not seem to exist, and if it did could we bare it?

    So ask yourself, what would you do in the shoes of these rich powerful businessmen and politicians? What decisions are they making/have they made for all of us? Would you line your pockets if you could? Would you enslave millions for completely unrestrained personal freedom?
    Mon, Jul 28, 2008  Permanent link
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    Yesterday; while waiting for a bus with my friend, I stopped to glance across at a middle aged man smoking. I stared at him intently before turning to my friend and asking him a question:

    What is it that makes people smoke? Why is it that people who smoke generally seem to be more interesting? Where does it come from? Why are they so cool?


    He stared at me a little absent minded, intent on drinking his coke, but he didn't need to say anything for my own imagination to swing into effect...

    It's breathing fire.

    Towards the beginning of human culture being able to create and manipulate fire was a sign of intelligence and power. The power to bring a group of people through a cold night with a blazing fire, it was almost instinctual. We know our genetic code changes very slowly, that instinct still remains.

    Throughout time many civilizations have had smoking rituals and practices, often involving other drugs as well. Of course it is these pagan, instinctual urges which are more often than not repressed among anti-smokers. These urges which make us human.

    The smokers are the only real community left in the workplace. Taking five minutes every hour to talk and reflect, to put down their work and relax - they return calm and centered, in short more productive. It is this calm collectedness which more often than not contributes to that 'cool' image. Even when they are not smoking.

    Lots of people smoke when they drink. They are feeling good, relaxed, and it makes them feel cool, and when you feel cool you act cool. Never mind the lie of it all; things don't have to be true or real to have a profound influence upon how a person thinks, never mind the cancer or health problems. The more danger you're in the more fun you tend to have... (That isn't to say that the person who thinks that they are cool simply from smoking is cool - but it's cool not to care)

    The benefit taking time out of your day to think about everything is enough reason in itself to smoke, the effect on your mindset, being relaxed and confident makes you the type of person people appreciate for their temperament. Stress destroys people.

    But then the smoker I was looking at before punched the bus stop sign - so you definitely can't say it works for everyone and of course the above reasoning is no more reasonable than "I want to live as long as I can so I won't smoke"
    Sat, Jul 26, 2008  Permanent link
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    These are the ones who fooled themselves...

    "Belief in God is stupid, illogical & insane" They shout. United. Not a bad beginning.

    Atheism is becoming a religion. They are uniting against religions, all of them. Wishing to get it abolished, to rebuild the twin towers, undo the crusades. Fuck them right? It's their freedoms, they can do whatever the fuck they want with them. It's hypocrisy. Hating on people for their religious choices. What do you think the crusades were? Every religious movement seems to have their own holier than thou spiel.

    If religions cannot live together, then having only one that remains once all the others have been exterminated would be a logical end point. But how do we choose which religion should be around at the end? How many people would give their lives trying to get there? Is Atheism a logical religion for the entire world population? Would the realization of having to make a better world for yourself now as opposed to the after-life have a positive influence upon society when this will would inspire crime within less fortunate people?

    My problem with atheists is so; my understanding is that atheism just means not believing in a God. This doesn't mean no religious thoughts or feelings, no spirituality and definitely does not mean common moral code. One atheist can think he is justified in killing another person because his feet were too big. It just didn't fit with his image of the world, so he fixed it up. The guy with the shoes too big may have also been an atheist, out to buy a pack of smokes.

    If you want to create an atheist, hating Christian religion. Then do that (Maybe you're an anti-theist), but let an atheist mean someone who doesn't believe in God. And leave it at that.

    To address the whole morality bullshit, people make up their own minds unless they're told and taught how and what to think. In our society, we are told exactly what to think and more often than not how to go about thinking it. For us to think as individuals, as people, that just because we are slightly aware of the shit we are being fed, we're somehow not going to get diseases from it. Our idea of morality is a predominately Christian one because we live in a Christian world. Christians have fallen a long way from what the bible says they ought to be, and we as a society are living on those ethical standards. For example: there are still debates over the validity of challenging God's will in genetics.

    (Apologies for the indecent lexical choices; I'm just an animal, I get angry sometimes).
    Tue, Jul 8, 2008  Permanent link
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    (Okay so the image is way old - but you can't underestimate stupidity)

    Humanity exists within classes. We have to get over the idea of everyone being equal. We just aren't — and it would be shit if we were. It's got a lovely ring to it though and as something to strive for it isn't entirely irrational.

    That's not to say; however, that some people are better than others. Which may seem as if I'm backstepping but allow me to continue...


    • Everyone thinks that they are better than everyone else

    • There is no such thing as a correct, right or true morality



    Therefore one is forced to make subjective judgments as to who is better or worse, different, more useful, funny etc. Of course someone has to make decisions that are going to influence other people eventually - and at this point in time there are some crucial decisions which humans as a species have got to make.

    Humanity has (as I paraphrase roughly some Nietzsche) two major classes. Master and slave. Strong and weak. Independent and herd. Naturally one cannot exist without the other, at least not without some kind of radical revolution. I think it would be pretty safe to say that everyone thinks they're unique, special, individual, free and so when trying to evaluate your own position it is important to consider such points. (For a brief wiki overview on master/slave moralities)

    It would be physically impossible; we do not have the resources, to upgrade everyone and to be sure, how could we determine that underlying personality traits would not remain - and if they wouldn't - you'd be waving goodbye to your own self who wanted the upgrade to begin with.

    For the purpose of this I'm considering upgrades as anything working towards this notion of "Human 2.0"

    Questions to consider (and I'm very interested in your responses):

    • What do we do with the weak? Or the strong for that matter, in their personal endeavors outside and beyond the common good?

    • What will the weak do to the strong if they are excluded from upgrades?

    • What will the weak do if they are given upgrades?

    • What is to stop an individual/group from becoming so powerful they can achieve their goal of world domination via manipulation, control or physical dominance once people have computer chips in their brains or they have strength/invincibility super powers?

    • Will human 2.0 be a superior being? Racism/Bigotry with scientific support sounds terribly dangerous to me...

    • Who should make these decisions? And who will?

    • If life is in essence entirely without objective purpose - what's the point?

    • If our desire for something more is human in nature, won't we possibly kill this and then negate the entire premise of upgrading?



    Obviously I'm pretty new to this whole transhumanism idea. But these are serious concerns I'm having with what I've probably misinterpreted so far.

    If you want to try and freak me out with some honest elitist stuff that would be fantastic, not to mention some common morality answers and perhaps something more insightful as well...
    Thu, Jun 19, 2008  Permanent link
    Categories: philosophy
    Sent to project: The great enhancement debate
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